I do get the sense of disrespect all the Warners talent must be feeling, but treating the theatrical experience as being so much more sacred than watching a movie at home is just nuts to me (as someone who has many favorite films I've only seen at home). I mean, what was the benefit of Tenet getting an exclusive theatrical release in the end? It made very little money domestically, it forced theatres to open when there was no audience, and most people will wind up watching for the first time on HBO or iTunes anyway. The only difference between Tenet and WW84 releases is that the Wonder Woman audience that does the responsible thing and avoids going to a theater won't be punished with a 6-8 month delay before they can see the film.
As for Disney, I get everyone's exhaustion with the IP farm, and but I do think there are some things that seem cool, largely because of the talent involved. Patty Jenkins doing a Rogue Squadron movie (in memory of her fighter pilot father, no less) and Leslye Headland doing a dark Jedi spy thriller both sound cool. I am trying to be more deliberate and measured in how I engage with the big franchises these days, but having storytellers with clear voices and personal investment in their stories goes a long way to making their continued existence worthwhile.
Yes, Pixar announced a shit ton of spin off content and Lightyear sounds like a weird idea but they also announced two completely original theatrical films, including one that looks like a departure from most of what they’ve done so far. So I very much disagree with calling them in decline.
Besides that, an excellent read. I can’t really find the motivation to hand wring too much about all the SW and Marvel content coming because I feel like I’ve reached the point where I don’t feel obligated to keep up with stuff. So I’ll probably sample the stuff and drop what I don’t enjoy immediately. I will say though that I’m pretty disappointed to see Jon Watts, a filmmaker that seems to have no definite sense of style or personality other than being a loyal soldier for Marvel get the gig for a film that needs to be as bold as a new F4 needs to be if it wants to be anything else than a third failed attempt.
And as to your question, I’m probably looking forward to Falcon and Winter Soldier the most.
I think it's interesting that the unspoken truth behind almost all these fanboy fights over the future of filmgoing is that the life-or-death stakes being assigned to Warner's move (and Disney's purposeful decision to announce a ton of things for the next two years, 75-85% of which is streaming only) are solely concerned with the big-budget blockbuster.
Because the truth is that for mid-budget films, adult-skewing films, indie-films, oscar-bait films, and anything that is not concerned with, or aiming at, the exploitation of nostalgia and familiarity with childhood entertainments of decades past - it's BEEN a streaming, home video landscape for them, for a DECADE now.
So many of these arguments and articles in various pop-culture outlets are spending a lot of time and energy not doing much more than expressing a very deep-seated worry that the adults are taking away their toybox before they're done playing with their toys. Nobody, of course, wants to admit that's the case, but its beyond obvious that's largely the reason people online are suddenly fighting hard as they can for the preservation of "The theatrical experience" at the benefit of astoundingly poor businesspeople like the sorts running Regal and AMC. Corporate-fueled fanboyism demands this reaction, and so you have people who have an almost impossible time conceiving of cinema existing pre-Terminator 2 suddenly sounding like Scorsese (who they were just shitting on a few months ago because he's not a fan of Captain Marvel) in their altrustic fervor to save the AMC 23 or whatever.
If they honestly cared that much about "the theatrical experience" they wouldn't have willingly, voluntarily helped transform that experience from one that rewards multiple genres, budgets, visions, and styles, to one that most closely resembles theme park attractions. But since basically everyone has voluntarily decided that absence of superheroes = "I'll wait til it hits Netflix" for years BEFORE this pandemic hit, I think it's far too late for these fake-sounding protestations to carry any serious weight. They're not worried about theaters. They're worried someone won't give some director they don't know all the budget they need to make a "real" version of a comic-book they don't read. That's it.
and by the time theaters are able to open to a capacity that will possibly allow all these $200 million movies to even sniff a break-even point anyway, this same audience will likely have been slow-boiled by Disney and Warners to EXPECT their big loud blockbuster fix on streaming anyway, since they'll have been steadily consuming something like 20-30 hours per month of interconnected, big-budget, superhero and sci-fi storytelling.
Drew, my hot take on Warner? It was going to happen no matter what. I get the stinkfest from the creators etc as you describe and many others. Unfortunately, Covid has accelerated the push towards what was already coming. Instead of it taking another 20 years... it's here now. HBOmax is a loss leader to ATT or whoever owns Warner. They are behind the 8ball on Disney, Netflix, and Amazon. This is the war for attention, not dollars. They have to compete with the little screen in our hands, not the ones in our rooms even let alone the vacant ones in theaters. In the war, this might have been the smartest move they could make... was it executed well- clearly not... but auteurs like Nolan can bitch that his art was meant to be seen on GIGANTIC IMAX, but in the year when doing that meant death... it was ridiculous of him. At least Warner has seen the writing on the wall, even if its not in a movie theater...
I have a guess to why Soul isn't getting the Premium VOD treatment yet Raya is, because the former is a Pixar film and Disney seems to want to only charge premium for films they themselves made as opposed to those made by other studios, which makes a kind of sense given Onward's quick release onto VOD.
It concerns me that you and your commenters are ignoring a simple truth in your overbearing support of streaming. If one is unemployed where is one going to find disposable income to invest in another streaming service and have additional monies to watch a film in HBO Max?
In looking at their slate of film's that they dumped on their steamer that lags substantially behind Netflix and Disney+ there are only two film's that remotely interest me: Eastwood's latest and the return of Neo in Matrix 4.
Puting 17 films on a streamer us an unsustainable economic model. How will contracts be fashioned? profit points distributed? Will movies be made for cheap say 10 million so. as not to incur massive write downs?
Seems to me WB needs every single subscriber to watch WW1984 and then some and that may not be enough. It costs more to stream then attending a screening at the cinema. And who has a 60 inch tv and top of the line sound system to fully enjoy?
I find it interesting that WB took care of Jenkins and Gadot and now want to claim they will be unable to pay put bonuses to their long standing make talent who have made WB over the last two decades. So the women got their additional monies but rest cannot be paid? Isn't that breaking contracts?
WB is so busy chasing Disney and Netflix- they may have burned their breeches and for everyone clamoring to watch first run movies at home it's going to cost you more than seeing it in the theater. This wasn't a move because of Covid,Covid gave them the excuse they needed to ramp up their streaming service and made fools out of a very gullible public.
What am I excited for? I read somewhere—although I can't find it now, so I may be mistaken—that ROGUE SQUADRON was set in the future, implying it was post-episode-9. Which would be pretty cool. I could stand more of Oscar Isaacs as Poe, if that's the way they went.
Mostly, tho, I just look at all the Marvel logos and think, man, I'd like to watch three of those, at least. But I don't want to have to commit to them all, and I feel like this how the storytelling is going to go. Which blows.
Love and enjoy your article! And yes this Star Wars gan girl is extremely excited for the new shows to come on Disney+ and I've been waiting to long for LOKI AND Finally it's coming!😍 so I will sit tight patiently for Star Wars world AND Marvel's new movies and shows! Thank you for this great article! Keep up the good work!😉
Great read, Drew. You hit the nail on the head at every turn. But this right here I think is the heart of the matter when it comes to streaming;
'I don’t believe either agency gives a shit where you see something as long as nothing gets in the way of the money they are set to earn on something, and that’s where the HBO Max deal really wasn’t carefully considered at all. '
It all comes down to the money. The money they would ALL, every single one of them, make off of a theatrical release. We live in the age of the Billion $$$ Movies. Spend $200 million making a movie, turn around and make an additional $600 off of it in the theaters, not to mention the DVD/BlueRay sales and whatnot. It's a massive investment with a ridiculous turn around in profit. The ultimate money maker.
And none of them want to see that change, but still and yet, here we are. There is no guarantee with streaming if it'll even be profitable at all. And then we have to wait and see if the movie has legs and people will come back for more. There's no money to be made in that. They want to instant gratification of a huge opening weekend and they can all buy 2 more homes somewhere abroad.
And they are scared. Looks to me like Disney is tripling down on their streaming service and giving EVERYONE, especially the huge nerd population, exactly what they want.
There is a lot to be exited for in those announcements. A LOT. My 10 yr old self would be in the fetal position for all the nerd-gasms racking my body. I just hope they are all good.
Meanwhile, I just finally completed my collection of the John Byrne run of Fantastic Four comics so I'm gonna do some reading. :)
Yeah man great post. Puts things in proper perspective. And a much big up respect FIST BUMP on calling out Nolan. Look I am a Nolan fan. I love his movies, even the obvious shaky ones, I will defend TDKR for all of its faults till my last breath. Hell I even bought the book by Tom Shone on his films..but Tenet, and it pains me to admit this, is a disaster. Even the scenes where I was supposed to be in awe I felt nothing. It was just like my screening of Rise of Skywalker -- scenes where I was supposed to be in awe I felt a numbness.
Like you said he reacted the way he did because of the obvious box office failure that will be a part of his resume for the rest of his career which limits his influence to get what he wants. There's no other way to spin it. And it's truly pathetic that "certain" members of the entertainment press and Youtubers like to add "but it cleaned up overseas." Sorry but no. It didn't do what it was supposed to do. Bad Boys For Life has made more than Tenet. Even if there was no pandemic it would have bombed for sure.
Anyway keep up the great posts. And I don't know if you said your were going to do this or not, but I hope you do a deep dissection of Tenet as well.
What was the most non-surprising thing that happened yesterday was the gigantic overwhelming feeling many people had. Throughout the 2010's, it seemed like when people watched these superhero movies, blockbusters and Star Wars films, the discussion was "You know, it would be cooler if they did this." "This will mean that in the next movie!" "They are making a (insert nostalgic IP here) into a cinematic universe!" People seemed very open last decade to get smothered by all of this nostalgic content. Now that the trigger has been pulled, suddenly many people thought "Wait, wait, wait...that's way too much content."
You can't seem to please the masses no matter what you do.
Anyway, I'm most excited to see The Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special.
Most excited? Probably the Willow series. Most of the other franchise stuff has had hits and misses over the years, but with only the original movie the *only* feelings I have for Willow are fond memories. Besides that, I have always been a sucker for What If...? and that teaser exceeded my expectations.
I do get the sense of disrespect all the Warners talent must be feeling, but treating the theatrical experience as being so much more sacred than watching a movie at home is just nuts to me (as someone who has many favorite films I've only seen at home). I mean, what was the benefit of Tenet getting an exclusive theatrical release in the end? It made very little money domestically, it forced theatres to open when there was no audience, and most people will wind up watching for the first time on HBO or iTunes anyway. The only difference between Tenet and WW84 releases is that the Wonder Woman audience that does the responsible thing and avoids going to a theater won't be punished with a 6-8 month delay before they can see the film.
As for Disney, I get everyone's exhaustion with the IP farm, and but I do think there are some things that seem cool, largely because of the talent involved. Patty Jenkins doing a Rogue Squadron movie (in memory of her fighter pilot father, no less) and Leslye Headland doing a dark Jedi spy thriller both sound cool. I am trying to be more deliberate and measured in how I engage with the big franchises these days, but having storytellers with clear voices and personal investment in their stories goes a long way to making their continued existence worthwhile.
Yes, Pixar announced a shit ton of spin off content and Lightyear sounds like a weird idea but they also announced two completely original theatrical films, including one that looks like a departure from most of what they’ve done so far. So I very much disagree with calling them in decline.
Besides that, an excellent read. I can’t really find the motivation to hand wring too much about all the SW and Marvel content coming because I feel like I’ve reached the point where I don’t feel obligated to keep up with stuff. So I’ll probably sample the stuff and drop what I don’t enjoy immediately. I will say though that I’m pretty disappointed to see Jon Watts, a filmmaker that seems to have no definite sense of style or personality other than being a loyal soldier for Marvel get the gig for a film that needs to be as bold as a new F4 needs to be if it wants to be anything else than a third failed attempt.
And as to your question, I’m probably looking forward to Falcon and Winter Soldier the most.
I think it's interesting that the unspoken truth behind almost all these fanboy fights over the future of filmgoing is that the life-or-death stakes being assigned to Warner's move (and Disney's purposeful decision to announce a ton of things for the next two years, 75-85% of which is streaming only) are solely concerned with the big-budget blockbuster.
Because the truth is that for mid-budget films, adult-skewing films, indie-films, oscar-bait films, and anything that is not concerned with, or aiming at, the exploitation of nostalgia and familiarity with childhood entertainments of decades past - it's BEEN a streaming, home video landscape for them, for a DECADE now.
So many of these arguments and articles in various pop-culture outlets are spending a lot of time and energy not doing much more than expressing a very deep-seated worry that the adults are taking away their toybox before they're done playing with their toys. Nobody, of course, wants to admit that's the case, but its beyond obvious that's largely the reason people online are suddenly fighting hard as they can for the preservation of "The theatrical experience" at the benefit of astoundingly poor businesspeople like the sorts running Regal and AMC. Corporate-fueled fanboyism demands this reaction, and so you have people who have an almost impossible time conceiving of cinema existing pre-Terminator 2 suddenly sounding like Scorsese (who they were just shitting on a few months ago because he's not a fan of Captain Marvel) in their altrustic fervor to save the AMC 23 or whatever.
If they honestly cared that much about "the theatrical experience" they wouldn't have willingly, voluntarily helped transform that experience from one that rewards multiple genres, budgets, visions, and styles, to one that most closely resembles theme park attractions. But since basically everyone has voluntarily decided that absence of superheroes = "I'll wait til it hits Netflix" for years BEFORE this pandemic hit, I think it's far too late for these fake-sounding protestations to carry any serious weight. They're not worried about theaters. They're worried someone won't give some director they don't know all the budget they need to make a "real" version of a comic-book they don't read. That's it.
and by the time theaters are able to open to a capacity that will possibly allow all these $200 million movies to even sniff a break-even point anyway, this same audience will likely have been slow-boiled by Disney and Warners to EXPECT their big loud blockbuster fix on streaming anyway, since they'll have been steadily consuming something like 20-30 hours per month of interconnected, big-budget, superhero and sci-fi storytelling.
Drew, my hot take on Warner? It was going to happen no matter what. I get the stinkfest from the creators etc as you describe and many others. Unfortunately, Covid has accelerated the push towards what was already coming. Instead of it taking another 20 years... it's here now. HBOmax is a loss leader to ATT or whoever owns Warner. They are behind the 8ball on Disney, Netflix, and Amazon. This is the war for attention, not dollars. They have to compete with the little screen in our hands, not the ones in our rooms even let alone the vacant ones in theaters. In the war, this might have been the smartest move they could make... was it executed well- clearly not... but auteurs like Nolan can bitch that his art was meant to be seen on GIGANTIC IMAX, but in the year when doing that meant death... it was ridiculous of him. At least Warner has seen the writing on the wall, even if its not in a movie theater...
"Avoid Songbird like the plague"? Nice.
Truly appreciate these points and that podcast rec. Will definitely check it out.
Great read. Thank you.
I have a guess to why Soul isn't getting the Premium VOD treatment yet Raya is, because the former is a Pixar film and Disney seems to want to only charge premium for films they themselves made as opposed to those made by other studios, which makes a kind of sense given Onward's quick release onto VOD.
It concerns me that you and your commenters are ignoring a simple truth in your overbearing support of streaming. If one is unemployed where is one going to find disposable income to invest in another streaming service and have additional monies to watch a film in HBO Max?
In looking at their slate of film's that they dumped on their steamer that lags substantially behind Netflix and Disney+ there are only two film's that remotely interest me: Eastwood's latest and the return of Neo in Matrix 4.
Puting 17 films on a streamer us an unsustainable economic model. How will contracts be fashioned? profit points distributed? Will movies be made for cheap say 10 million so. as not to incur massive write downs?
Seems to me WB needs every single subscriber to watch WW1984 and then some and that may not be enough. It costs more to stream then attending a screening at the cinema. And who has a 60 inch tv and top of the line sound system to fully enjoy?
I find it interesting that WB took care of Jenkins and Gadot and now want to claim they will be unable to pay put bonuses to their long standing make talent who have made WB over the last two decades. So the women got their additional monies but rest cannot be paid? Isn't that breaking contracts?
WB is so busy chasing Disney and Netflix- they may have burned their breeches and for everyone clamoring to watch first run movies at home it's going to cost you more than seeing it in the theater. This wasn't a move because of Covid,Covid gave them the excuse they needed to ramp up their streaming service and made fools out of a very gullible public.
Note it should read males not made
What am I excited for? I read somewhere—although I can't find it now, so I may be mistaken—that ROGUE SQUADRON was set in the future, implying it was post-episode-9. Which would be pretty cool. I could stand more of Oscar Isaacs as Poe, if that's the way they went.
Mostly, tho, I just look at all the Marvel logos and think, man, I'd like to watch three of those, at least. But I don't want to have to commit to them all, and I feel like this how the storytelling is going to go. Which blows.
Love and enjoy your article! And yes this Star Wars gan girl is extremely excited for the new shows to come on Disney+ and I've been waiting to long for LOKI AND Finally it's coming!😍 so I will sit tight patiently for Star Wars world AND Marvel's new movies and shows! Thank you for this great article! Keep up the good work!😉
Great read, Drew. You hit the nail on the head at every turn. But this right here I think is the heart of the matter when it comes to streaming;
'I don’t believe either agency gives a shit where you see something as long as nothing gets in the way of the money they are set to earn on something, and that’s where the HBO Max deal really wasn’t carefully considered at all. '
It all comes down to the money. The money they would ALL, every single one of them, make off of a theatrical release. We live in the age of the Billion $$$ Movies. Spend $200 million making a movie, turn around and make an additional $600 off of it in the theaters, not to mention the DVD/BlueRay sales and whatnot. It's a massive investment with a ridiculous turn around in profit. The ultimate money maker.
And none of them want to see that change, but still and yet, here we are. There is no guarantee with streaming if it'll even be profitable at all. And then we have to wait and see if the movie has legs and people will come back for more. There's no money to be made in that. They want to instant gratification of a huge opening weekend and they can all buy 2 more homes somewhere abroad.
And they are scared. Looks to me like Disney is tripling down on their streaming service and giving EVERYONE, especially the huge nerd population, exactly what they want.
There is a lot to be exited for in those announcements. A LOT. My 10 yr old self would be in the fetal position for all the nerd-gasms racking my body. I just hope they are all good.
Meanwhile, I just finally completed my collection of the John Byrne run of Fantastic Four comics so I'm gonna do some reading. :)
Yeah man great post. Puts things in proper perspective. And a much big up respect FIST BUMP on calling out Nolan. Look I am a Nolan fan. I love his movies, even the obvious shaky ones, I will defend TDKR for all of its faults till my last breath. Hell I even bought the book by Tom Shone on his films..but Tenet, and it pains me to admit this, is a disaster. Even the scenes where I was supposed to be in awe I felt nothing. It was just like my screening of Rise of Skywalker -- scenes where I was supposed to be in awe I felt a numbness.
Like you said he reacted the way he did because of the obvious box office failure that will be a part of his resume for the rest of his career which limits his influence to get what he wants. There's no other way to spin it. And it's truly pathetic that "certain" members of the entertainment press and Youtubers like to add "but it cleaned up overseas." Sorry but no. It didn't do what it was supposed to do. Bad Boys For Life has made more than Tenet. Even if there was no pandemic it would have bombed for sure.
Anyway keep up the great posts. And I don't know if you said your were going to do this or not, but I hope you do a deep dissection of Tenet as well.
Fantastic read like always, kudos sir, hit the nail on the head on everything.
Wow, another fantastic read. Thank you, sir!
What was the most non-surprising thing that happened yesterday was the gigantic overwhelming feeling many people had. Throughout the 2010's, it seemed like when people watched these superhero movies, blockbusters and Star Wars films, the discussion was "You know, it would be cooler if they did this." "This will mean that in the next movie!" "They are making a (insert nostalgic IP here) into a cinematic universe!" People seemed very open last decade to get smothered by all of this nostalgic content. Now that the trigger has been pulled, suddenly many people thought "Wait, wait, wait...that's way too much content."
You can't seem to please the masses no matter what you do.
Anyway, I'm most excited to see The Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special.
Most excited? Probably the Willow series. Most of the other franchise stuff has had hits and misses over the years, but with only the original movie the *only* feelings I have for Willow are fond memories. Besides that, I have always been a sucker for What If...? and that teaser exceeded my expectations.